This episode was produced by UIC communication students Agnes Wesolowski ‘16, Brandon Hinrichs ‘16, Corinna Giacalone ‘16, and Esther Lupancu ’16. It explores the variety of effects screen time may have on children. The guests were Liz Miller (parent of twins), Dr. Adrienne Massanari (UIC), and Dr. Sherri Katz (U of Minnesota).
This podcast is a class exercise and it does not represent the views and opinions of the University of Illinois at Chicago or any of its departments.
Produced: Spring 2016.
While working on this project, Agnes Wesolowski’s op-ed on this topic was published in the Daily Herald.
Transcript
[MUSIC: InfoNation theme music and intro] Welcome to InfoNation, University of Illinois at Chicago’s very own podcast created by students, for students. At InfoNation we discover how media, information, and communication are created, governed and used. Produced by upper-level communication students in the Department of Communication, InfoNation brings academic research to help make sense of our increasingly mediated society. We go to the library so that you won’t have to.
[Esther Lupancu] Hello this is Esther, and today we will be focusing on an ever-important topic that seems to be drawing increased attention as the years go by: kids and screen technology. Throughout the course of this podcast, we will be exploring the problem of over-exposing children to screen technology. You will hear from the mother of young children and her opinion on this matter, you will also hear an interview with an academic professional whose research interests include youth and digital media, as well as some insight on the topic from a Communication professor at the University. But before we dive in, we sent Agnes to talk to the real experts and find out what they think…
[Agnes Wesolowski] Thank you Esther! I visited the preschool class of Holy Trinity Polish Saturday School and asked some of the students their opinion on screens, here’s what they had to say…
[MUSIC]
[AW] How old are you?
[KID 1] Uhhh, I’m three.
[KID 2] Three.
[KID 3] I’m… three and a half.
[AW] And what’s your favorite game?
[KID 4] Umm… Playing balls.
[AW] Playing with a ball?
[KID 4] Yes
[AW] Outside?
[KID 4] Yeah
[AW] Okay
[KID 1] Television.
[KID 5] Checkers.
[KID 3] Umm… Candyland.
[KID 5] [mumbles] Snow White.
[AW] Snow White?
[KID 5] Mhm
[AW] Is it a computer game or iPad game?
[KID 5] iPad
[AW] iPad… Do you rather play video games or playing on the iPad or do you like playing outside better?
[KID 3] I like playing on my computer.
[KID 1] [giggles] Uhh, I could play outside with my bubbles.
[KID 4] Um, computer games.
[KID 5] I like playing outside.
[AW] Playing outside? …Do you watch TV at home?
[KID 3] [giggles] yes
[KID 4] Yeahhh…
[AW] Yeah?
[KIDS 3 & 6]: Yes
[AW] Do you rather play outside or watch TV?
[KID 5] Watch TV.
[KID 4] Watch TV.
[AW] Do you have a favorite TV show or movie?
[KID 3] We have different kinds of movies, like we have Anna and Elsa movie.
[KID 1] I have Frozen!
[KID 2] I have… McQueen.
[KID 4] Mickey Mouse [giggles]
[AW] Do you watch a lot of TV at home?
[KID 3] No, daddy says it’s not good for our eyes.
[KID 5] Yeah
[KID 6] Yes
[KID 2] …No
[AW] How much TV do you watch at home? Do you watch a lot of TV, or not so much?
[KID 5] Not so much.
[AW] Not so much. Does mommy and daddy say that it’s bad for you, or?
[KID 5] It’s not bad!
[AW] Do you know how to use a computer or an iPad?
[KID 1] Yeah!
[AW] Yeah?
[KID 5] Yeah!
[KID 4] No, I got a toy computer.
[KID 2] And I don’t know, just my mama and my dad can do it.
[AW] Do you like technology?
[KID 6] Yes
[KID 1] Yeah
[AW] Yeah?
[KID 2] No
[KID 3] Yeah
[KID 5] No
[KID 4] Nahh! [giggles] Silly!
[KID 5] Yes!
[AW] Why do you like technology? What do you like about technology?
[KID 3] Because um, they have different kinds of movies and iPads.
[KID 1] Because I love it…
[KID 5] Because I like it!
[AW] You like it so much?
[KID 1] Yeah…
[MUSIC]
[AW] Now that we know what the little ones think, let’s turn the table to the other side. Liz Miller is the mother of two 5-year-old twin boys, and she has agreed to speak with us today. Welcome to the show, Liz.
[AW] Welcome to the show Liz. Do you implement screen time rules for your kids at home?
[LIZ MILLER] We do. Loosely. We keep it very low, I think, but we don’t always check the clock. They just don’t have that much time. There’s just not much time in a day that allows for that. They go to school all day long, they often have after school activities, sports and tae-kwon-do and by the time they get home, there’s just no time.
[AW] What would you say is more important to you. How much time your boys are spending in front of the screen or what content they are watching?
[LM] At age 5, they have no decision-making power about what they watch. We are much more concerned about the content of what they’re doing which is almost entirely educational. Because that’s what interests them right now, they happen to be very into the solar system and the body and how systems work and things like that. So, that’s what they wanna watch, they’re not trying to watch Spongebob, they’re not trying to watch random videos on YouTube or anything like that.
[AW] Um how old were your kids when you first deliberately introduced them to screen technology?
[LM] I don’t know if any parent deliberately introduces them to screen technology.
[AW] Yeah.
[LM] It’s just everywhere you are um.
[AW] Exactly.
[LM] I remember being at a doctor’s appointment with one of them when he was probably 3.
[AW] Mhm.
[LM] And we were in this waiting room that was jammed with people and I pulled something up on my phone and gave it to him cause we had nothing else. I just did not expect it to be a really long wait.
[AW] Yeah, mhmh.
[LM] And I remember thinking like this is the beginning of having to give him my phone everywhere I go and I have twins so we can’t. I mean unless my husband and I are together, there’s not two phones to give them so I don’t want to get in that habit of them thinking if there’s a lull in activity that they should get my phone. They definitely saw TV before that. We were aware of that AAP recommendation.
[AW] Oh yeah?
[LM] About nothing before age 2.
[AW] Okay.
[LM] Which seemed completely unrealistic to me so we did not get to 2 before they ever saw a screen. Definitely did not.
[AW] Yeah.
[LM] But it was a rarity until they were 2.
[AW] Okay, okay. So I was just gonna ask. So would you say that you sometimes do use, you know, either TV or like a tablet or something like that just so that you can go and get chores finished, work on stuff.
[LM] Yes. Yes.
[AW] Yeah?
[LM] Definitely. It is the only thing that we can guarantee that they will.
[AW] Stay out of trouble.
[LM] Divert from.
[AW] Yeah.
[LM] Exactly.
[AW] So are you worried about your children, as they get older that they might become too consumed with screen technology?
[LM] I don’t necessarily worry that they’ll become obsessed with it.
[AW] Mhm.
[LM] But I do think their standards will be different from mine and from my husband’s. You know, it is hard to imagine a volcano or a deep sea dive without the use of videos and since they’re available, why wouldn’t you use them to show these, show your kids these, you want them to understand. But I do hope they’ll still be able to conceptualize these things from books.
[AW] Yeah.
[LM] I want them to be able to read a book and imagine what it looks like and not think, “I’m gonna look up what this looks like”. So that’s what I kinda worry about. You know maybe my husband and I are out one night.
[AW] Mhm.
[LM] And we come home in the morning, they say, “what did you do?” And we say “oh we went out with some friends and went to dinner.” They’ll say can I see a video?
[AW] Oh.
[LM] You know, they think everything is available on video or in some sort of image for them.
[AW] Yeah.
[LM] So I don’t really worry about them becoming obsessed with it but I do think it will be much more the norm. The reality is, we’re going into a digital world.
[AW] Yeah.
[LM] I mean we are in a digital world
[AW] There’s nothing to stop that.
[LM] Absolutely. So I think this idea of time limiting is pretty unrealistic. There’s just too many things to do. They’re getting iPads in schools.
[AW] Yes.
[LM] That is part. That is how they get their homework done that way.
[AW] Yeah.
[LM] You can’t take two hours of screen time if they have to do four hours of homework. On their iPad.
[AW] Exactly. Yes.
[LM] Yeah.
[AW] Perfect. Do you have anything else to add?
[LM] My kids are still very young. I know this challenge is gonna get a lot harder as they get older and have more control and more opinions about what they want to see. Right now they are not that influenced by what other people are interested in. They just don’t get it yet.
[AW] Oh
[LM] So I know this is gonna get harder and I know that we are ourselves are gonna get more laxed because as they get older, the things we wanna watch and the things they wanna watch are gonna overlap more.
[AW] Exactly.
[LM] And we may say, “oh let’s just put on a show before bed that we can all enjoy”
[AW] Yeah.
[LM] So we, I know we’re going to have to make more choices than we have to make now.
[AW] Mhhm. Yeah. Well thank you very much for your time.
[LM] Your welcome. You’re very welcome
[AW] Thank you for your time and wonderful insights, Liz. We will now turn the conversation over to Corinna.
[CORINNA GIACALONE] So I just want to start off by saying welcome to the InfoNation Podcast, and I’d just like to start with you giving a brief introduction of yourself just so our listeners know who’s on the other line.
[ADRIENNE MASSANARI] Yes, um, my name is Adrienne Massanari and I am an assistant professor at the University of Illinois at Chicago, Department of Communication.
[CG] And can you give us a little background on your research?
[AM] Sure. I’m interested in generally the social, cultural implications of new media technology. Um, I’ve written on things such as Reddit. I also do work on video games, and digital ethics, and design.
[CG] So, our main focus for this episode in particular is “Kids and Screen-Time”.
[AM] I’m more concerned about sort of the rhetoric around the fact that we are very, very concerned as a culture with kids having access to these devices, but that we don’t really have a good sense of sort of the science behind that, and whether or not that’s really something we need to be um worried about. Maybe contrary to Sherry Turkle who’s the big person who’s been talking about sort of the depth of conversation and the depth of the dinner table. You know we don’t really know that that’s really what the problem is.
[CG] Right, right. I think part of the problem is um, the parents these days, they just don’t have that information at their fingertips. It’s not being talked about enough.
[AM] Right. And it’s also the other issue is, and I think this is the part that, I mean Sherry Turkle and her book, “The Conversation.” I believe that’s her newest book, talks about is that, part of it is the parents themselves are really addicted to screen-time, right?!, so..
[CG] Right.
[AM] (Laughing)
[CG] Exactly.
[AM] So it’s hard to sort of set boundaries with kids if your parents were equally sort of we could not pejoratively say this, but pejoratively say addicted to their screen, you know screens. One of the things that um I’m sure you came across the work of Danah Boyd, who does a lot of work with youth and technology. She talks a lot about the idea that when we think about kids and going online and there’s sort of all these moral panics that we have about , for example, kids going on the social networks and sharing material that they shouldn’t share…or using or um or taking selfies or whatever…you know sexting people. All those kinds of things that we sort of, we kind of see as being perhaps negative. You know she’s saying, well what’s happened is you’ve created a culture in which kids used to go out and you know sort of roam around the neighborhood on their bikes and daily, and have that experience, and now working with them all together, whatever and those phases don’t exist anymore. That’s not where kids hang out. So they hang out online.
[CG] Thank you for that insight. I’m sure our listeners would like to follow your research. Where can they find you?
[AM] Yeah, I’m uh I’m at (@hegemonyrules) which is kind of a mouthful on Twitter. I’m also, um you can find me on the UIC’s Department of Communication website, and my email address and information is there. Or you can go to my personal website, which is (adriennemassanari.com).
[CG] Thank you Adrienne.
[AM] Awesome! Thank you. Have a good one!
[CG] Thank you so much. You too!
[CG] Now we’ll hand the mic over to Esther who will be interviewing our second expert, on the topic of kids and screens.
[EL] Hello and welcome to this episode of InfoNation. To start off, if you could just give us a brief introduction to our listeners.
[SHERRI KATZ] Yeah, so my name is Sherri Katz and I have….first I have a professional background in advertising and public relations. Um I worked for about 14 years professionally in the industry. Um I also have a PHD and I’m a faculty member at the University of Minnesota uh where I research persuasion technology in youth.
[EL] Nice, that sounds great. Um well we’re really excited to have you so thank you again for being here with us. So let’s begin. This episode is on children and screen technology, so we’re specifically looking at the different effects uh the use of screen technology, that it has on children. So if you could just tell us a little about your research pertaining to children using the Internet.
[SK] Sure so um some of the work that I’ve done has involved how children use the Internet and what their parents know about it so in other words, specifically teenagers so um one finding that I have from a few papers, it’s a few different proj- uh it’s one big project with a few different papers, is that uh parents tend to underestimate how often kids experience risky activity online. Things like cyberbullying, looking at pornography, and then they overestimate how often their kids are using the Internet for beneficial purposes like homework and even seeking health information but what we find is that kids are very visible with what they do online in a way that’s positive so in other words they will show their parents when they’re doing homework and I mean this goes without saying, it’s kind of obvious but they do sort of hide the more risky experiences so they hide when they’re getting cyberbullied and they hide when they are doing things that maybe they shouldn’t be like looking at pornography.
[EL] Uh huh, yeah. Ok great. So the American Pediatrics Association, um so they first recommended that no screen time for under the…for children under the age of 2 but now that’s changed. Do you have any you know, insight on that.
[SK] I think they recently did change that and that was actually very telling because I think um what they’re starting to recognize and what they have said instead is that what they recommend is that parents are mediating and being aware of how their kids are using technology. Um so one of the things that they made a distinction between um and that scholars have started making a distinction between, researchers have started making a distinction between uh really screen time that is interactive and screen time that isn’t interactive. So in other words, there isn’t a difference between Face-timing with your grandparents for example, versus sitting in front of a screen as a toddler, as a young child, and just passively watching something um and both are okay in moderation obviously the first is far more interactive, we’re less concerned about that in terms of screen time um but with every um sort of type of media that’s used, it changes in some way how we process this information and how we think and certainly, you know, children today are um growing up and young kids right now are growing up in a world they’re sort of always connected and always on and that’s all they’ve ever known
[EL] Yeah.
[SK] So having access to media all the time is a very big thing. Um but in my own view, I think.. you know that kids can learn for sure from media um they, you know, they used to think they can’t learn at all before age 2. I actually don’t believe that, I think they learn different after age 2. They have language skills by 2, they’re starting to develop language so they’re going to learn in a different way um I think where we have to be careful is if kids are just so sitting, just passively watching versus doing something, whether playing a game, talking to somebody, um that’s like I said, the passive watching is okay in moderation I think um and certainly um what we find is kids do make connections. Um I did a project with very young kids and old um up until teenagers and what I found is that some of the simple connections like between eating vegetables and being healthy, if you’re trying to teach that in a media lesson, they get that.
[EL] Mhhm, yeah
[SK] Even at a very young age so.
[EL] Yeah wow great. So I know that you’ve done some research on persuasion technology in youth, is there anything really surprising that you found in advertising content having an affect on children?
[SK] The big study that I did there was finding the connection that they do make connections in the messages uh so the big thing that um scholars have shown is that kids don’t really differentiate ads versus other content.
[EL] Uh huh
[SK] They don’t understand the difference. They might understand their favorite characters left the screen, you know something else is happening um but they don’t really understand the goal of a persuasion message, they don’t have the mindset of understanding someone’s trying to sell me something so they take it very matter of factly and we know that from other literature, in my work, I was able to show that they can actively process the message meaning that they can make those connections between those simple activities and those simple goals but that’s a little different than understanding the persuasive purpose of the message
[EL] Okay.
[SK] So they understand that you know, they may understand if I eat vegetables then I’m healthier than if I eat cookies, they might get that sort of message from a..from a persuasive ad like a say a health campaign but what they don’t get is that like if somebody is showing them a cereal ad, they don’t necessarily understand that..you know, eating cereal, this company is trying to sell me this cereal and that’s why they’re making it look fun and good. They just see fun, good cereal.
[EL] Okay.
[SK] If that makes sense.
[EL] Yeah.
[SK] They don’t understand the pur- the motivation, I guess, of the advertiser.
[EL] Okay.
[SK] And that’s a big thing. Um and it’s about 8 years old where that starts to switch over.
[EL] Okay, wow. Um is there anything else that you would like to add that we haven’t really covered yet?
[SK] Yeah. So one thing, I think, and this happens with every generation is that there is some sort of backlash against the media um with oh the media is making our kids whether it’s lazy, whether it’s inactive, whether it’s um, and there is some truth to that you know in a sense that if you spent all of your days just watching television day and night um or if your child does nothing else that’s intellectually engaging or if your toddler, who rather than going to school or or working with other kids or going to play groups, if you’re just sitting there in front of the television all the time every day, you’re going to have uh negative effects.
[EL] Mhh, mhh.
[SK] There will be negative effects. However, if it’s mixed into life in the same way it is in our life, it is something that we, media, is something that we all are engaging with every day. Then it’s a different story and I think that then it’s about what you’re doing and making sure what you are doing is moderate. But I will say and I say this having a daughter myself, is that sometimes we don’t actually as adults show the best behavior either. If I’m sitting there with my phone at the dinner table, I’m training that connection to screen time.
[EL] Yeah.
[SK] ..That maybe isn’t the best connection to be training and I find myself doing that a lot which isn’t good (laughs).
[EL] Yeah, I think a lot of people are guilty of that (laughs). Great.
[SK] So, yeah. I hope this has helped and uh..
[EL] Yeah! It’s..it’s awesome. Yeah thank you so much um so although our time has been short, we do have to wrap things up. So if our listeners want to follow your research, where can they find you?
[SK] Sure, so I have a website. It’s SherriJeanKatz.com uh which is my full name um and also I’m reachable through the University of Minnesota. They have a page for School of Journalism.
[EL] Alright great well thank you again Sherri. It’s been a great pleasure.
[EL] Unfortunately our podcast is slowly drawing to a close, so here is Brandon with a quick recap.
[BRANDON HINRICHS] Thanks, Esther. So in today’s podcast you heard from a bunch of toddlers expressing their opinions on the topic of kids and screen time; you also listened to a mother of two young boys explaining her experience with raising kids in this digital world; and finally, you heard from two academic experts who conduct research in this field. After listening to all of this information, we hope that you understand the need to work together as a community to educate others on healthy screen usage habits, starting with displaying them ourselves. Hopefully, the examination of each perspective concerning the topic of kids and screens will provide new insight to parents, child caretakers, and educators alike, helping them make healthy and responsible decisions regarding screen time usage for their children. Your children and grandchildren will thank you!
[EL] To wrap things up, I, Esther Lupancu, want to take a moment to thank my co-hosts: Agnes Wesolowski, Corinna Giacalone, and Brandon Hinrichs. Thank you to the preschool class of Holy Trinity School. Thank you Bensound for providing background music to the kids’ comments. Thank you to our interviewees: Liz Miller, Dr. Adrienne Massanari, and Dr. Sherri Katz. And of course, thank you to our listeners for tuning in!
[MUSIC: Podcast outro and theme music] Thanks for listening to InfoNation! Coming to you from the University of Illinois at Chicago Department of Communication. Our theme music was created by Shawn Rizvi, a 2015 graduate. We hope we piqued your interest and you learned something new today. Please feel free to engage by rating, commenting or sharing our episodes.
Additional readings
Anderson, S. E., Economos, C. D., & Must, A. (2008). Active play and screen time in US children aged 4 to 11 years in relation to sociodemographic and weight status characteristics: A nationally representative cross-sectional analysis. BMC Public Health, 8(1), 1.
Daugherty, L., Dossani, R., Johnson, E., Wright, C., & Education, R. (2014). Moving beyond screen time: Redefining developmentally appropriate technology use in early childhood education. Policy brief RAND Corporation.
Duch, H., Fisher, E. M., Ensari, I., & Harrington, A. (2013). Screen time use in children under 3 years old: a systematic review of correlates. International Journal Of Behavioral Nutrition & Physical Activity, 10102-111.
Ernest, J. M., Causey, C., Newton, A. B., Sharkins, K., Summerlin, J., & Albaiz, N. (2014). Extending the global dialogue about media, technology, screen time, and young children. Childhood Education, 90(3), 182-191. doi:10.1080/00094056.2014.910046
Hesketh, K. D., Hinkley, T., & Campbell, K. J. (2012). Children’s physical activity and screen time: qualitative comparison of views of parents of infants and preschool children. International Journal Of Behavioral Nutrition & Physical Activity, 9152-165.
Monitoring Screen Time. (2011). Teaching Young Children, 5(1), 30-31.
Slutsky, R., Slutsky, M., & DeShelter, L. M. (2014). Playing with technology: Is it all bad? Dimensions of Early Childhood, 42(3), 18-23.
Strasburger, V. C., Jordan, A. B., & Donnerstein, E. (2012). Children, adolescents, and the media: Health effects. Pediatric Clinics of North America, 59(3), 533-587.
Sweetser, P., Johnson, D., Ozdowska, A., & Wyeth, P. (2012). Active versus passive screen time for young children. Australasian Journal of Early Childhood, 37(4), 94-98.
Vittrup, B., Snider, S., Rose, K. K., & Rippy, J. (2016). Parental perceptions of the role of media and technology in their young children’s lives. Journal of Early Childhood Research, 14(1), 43-54. doi:10.1177/1476718X14523749